Luke Dowling - DOF

[Ravi]

I can't see anyone 'forcing' players onto Karanka, can you? That's not to say all of the choices were his. He's used to being involved in collective decision making re player recruitment from his time at Real and Boro, so it's hardly a culture shock for him. We know he's had input into at least some of the players recruited.

His responsibilities and skills are best suited to the role of first team manager, not being the head of scouting, overseeing the academy, training ground and other infrastructure, medical, physiotherapy etc etc. Let him get on with his job rather than being hampered by these other tasks.

Clubs aren't run like street corner sole trader sweet shops anymore. These days they are more like large supermarkets which need to be organised more efficiently and with longer term planning.

 

[Flaggers]

Mods!! Shouldn't this be moved to the "ex players" board?!

 

[Strummer]

Mods!! Shouldn't this be moved to the "ex players" board?!

Yes.

 

[mister]

His responsibilities and skills are best suited to the role of first team manager, not being the head of scouting, overseeing the academy, training ground and other infrastructure, medical, physiotherapy etc etc. Let him get on with his job rather than being hampered by these other tasks.

Spot on. It'll be about communication and delegation, not who wins 'head butting sessions'.

 

[MASE]

Spot on. It'll be about communication and delegation, not who wins 'head butting sessions'.

I get that, I just don't understand why it needs a neutral perspective from an all singing all dancing Luke Dowling, if its someone purely carrying out Karankas wishes.

Does the outlay justify the input, given he probably doesnt have much, which is probably why he's leaving.

 

[Alf-engelos Mindminackers]

His responsibilities and skills are best suited to the role of first team manager, not being the head of scouting, overseeing the academy, training ground and other infrastructure, medical, physiotherapy etc etc. Let him get on with his job rather than being hampered by these other tasks.

That's a fair point. I guess it's the envisaged role of DOF I'm not keen on, the one of "DOF build the club, manager is an interchangeable".

The duties you mention here I'd definitely sooner have any manager not have to faff with.

 

[Rzar]

Worked for Brian Clough.

There is no safety in football. A DOF's choice of players is just an opinion much like a managers. I'm not against it, it's just a fantasy that having a DOF makes much difference.

Have someone who knows their onions signing good players. If that's only the manager sound. If it's one person or two people sound, but the illusion that having a DPF makes some amazing difference is gumph IMO. Having good people at the club makes the difference.

Completely different era. Times change. Back managers by all means, but they shouldn't get free reign until they earn it at a club.

The reality is nobody has any idea what Dowling's day to day roles were at the club, he could have just been in charge of scouting or he could have had an open chequebook to sign his players. Nobody will know until they speak publicly.

Whatever he did, he probably did it better than McParland.

 

[Rzar]

Compensation for a technical director? That's odd.

Not really. Any staff under a contract without a break clause will require compensation surely.

The same will go for a manager.

 

[Alf-engelos Mindminackers]

Completely different era. Times change. Back managers by all means, but they shouldn't get free reign until they earn it at a club.

The reality is nobody has any idea what Dowling's day to day roles were at the club, he could have just been in charge of scouting or he could have had an open chequebook to sign his players. Nobody will know until they speak publicly.

Whatever he did, he probably did it better than McParland.

Not saying they need a free reign, just disputing the fact that there needs to be someone above them to influence the first team if they're good, trustworthy managers.

You looking for a Dowling Vs McPharland debate?

 

[JRSG]

good news if he's replaced. Don't rate it if they're just not going to have one going forward.

 

[Matt]

My favourite pie shop in the whole world. Young Vegans in Camden Market - the 'chicken' parmesan pie with a side of 'cheesy' fries and red wine gravy.

Gets me hard thinking about it. Ooft.

 

[Steve Stone's Mullet]

Don't think it could happen because people would stupidly want him as manager again if things weren't going well on the pitch, but would love to see Pearce as DOF. Think everything about him is made for the role.

 

[GreeksBearingGifts]

Not really. Any staff under a contract without a break clause will require compensation surely.

The same will go for a manager.

Of course; I meant it's strange for a club to want a particular DoF so much that they're willing to pay compensation fees for him.

 

[Wes' Organ]

When did steak and kidney go out of fashion?

I had one for the first time in ages the other week, home made pub jobby and it was bloody lovely.

 

[Notcher]

Left the club by mutual consent. Interesting one. Who's decision and who comes in to replace him?

https://www.nottinghamforest.co.uk/news/2018/september/dowling-departs#NFFC

Sent from my sweaty palms using Tapatalk

 

[Alf-engelos Mindminackers]

Left the club by mutual consent. Interesting one. Who's decision and who comes in to replace him?

https://www.nottinghamforest.co.uk/news/2018/september/dowling-departs#NFFC

Sent from my sweaty palms using Tapatalk

Stuart Pearce? sycho:

If folk want a pro-run club you don't get more pro than that man. Add to that the fact he's an eye for a player + the lift he would bring with him, and there's a lot of positives.

 

[Heffing Psycho!]

This is disappointing. We need someone who will stop and actually see out their time here, can't blame the club for this one though if his heads been turned by WBA.

As for replacements I'd bet whoever it is will be Iberian, Paco Hererra was rumoured back when Karanka came in but he's in work and so is Karanka's old DoF at Boro Victor Orta. So my random stab in the dark is Fernando Hierro; did the job for Spain and Malaga, currently out of work after the World Cup and played with Karanka for years at Real Madrid. People will say he's out of our league but he did play for Bolton.

 

[Captain Sinister]

Dowling appointed DOF at WBA.
Source: BBC this a.m.

 

[MaxiRobriguez]

That's my thinking, I dont see where a Luke Dowling fits into a head butting session between Heavyweights like Marinakis, Vrentsos, Mendes & Karanka.

It just seems like an expensive chief scout.

"Dunderhead"

Probably correct but reaffirms the eggs in one basket approach.

 

[belefonte]

Probably correct but reaffirms the eggs in one basket approach.

How does it reaffirm the eggs in one basket approach?

 

[MaxiRobriguez]

How does it reaffirm the eggs in one basket approach?

That the club are very much reliant on Karanka doing well and Mendes link supporting his ambitions, and that there's not really a succession plan in place that typically comes with a DOF approach.

I don't think Dowling leaving changes much, he probably wasn't doing anything anyway.

 

[belefonte]

That the club are very much reliant on Karanka doing well and Mendes link supporting his ambitions, and that there's not really a succession plan in place that typically comes with a DOF approach.

I don't think Dowling leaving changes much, he probably wasn't doing anything anyway.

Which clubs have a succession plan? How do you know we haven't got one?

 

[MaxiRobriguez]

Which clubs have a succession plan? How do you know we haven't got one?

Lots of clubs have - Swansea and Southampton have been the poster boys for it in recent years.

And I suspect we don't have one because Karanka's brought in 20+ players in a short time frame, spent a fair chunk of money, the majority of which has been on Mendes clients, which will see the club start to push FFP embargo boundaries if the same approach is repeated in January or summer. It's not particularly conducive to stability. Anyone new to the club after that will be in a position with limited money to spend, with a squad consisting pretty much only of the previous guys signings.

Like I said - I don't think Dowling leaving actually changes anything. We've been operating this way for a number of months now. I also am not against it. Bringing Karanka in and not giving him the tools he needed would have been a complete waste of time. But saying that, we are in a position whereby if he leaves the club and were not promoted, we are very limited on alternative options. But we all knew that, and accepted that, right?

 

[Steve Stone's Mullet]

I envisage that the managers EM will bring in will be very much used to being in control of squads they have not built.

Don't see why him going (hopefully not for some time) would give us limited options all of a sudden.

 

[MaxiRobriguez]

I envisage that the managers EM will bring in will be very much used to being in control of squads they have not built.

Don't see why him going (hopefully not for some time) would give us limited options all of a sudden.

Didn't mean limited options in personnel, meant in terms of shaking up how the club operates both on and off the pitch.

If a new guy comes in, they'll just have to get more out of Karanka's squad than Karanka did. We'll be limited in transfer market and with changing tactical approach.

At that point you start to ask yourself is the change worth making? The club would have to be in a bit of a crisis to make it an emphatic 'yes'. If we're mid-table plodders then there's no immediacy to act given constraints listed and no guarantee that a new manager will be able to magic up better performances from Karanka's players than Karanka could manage. In alternative circumstances it may have been more in our interest to act.

Which comes back to my original point - feels a bit 'eggs in one basket'