The Demise of Adlène Guedioura

[Alf-engelos Mindminackers]

I remember some posters suggesting signing Leadbitter would be overkill in the summer.

 

[gamble]

I remember some posters suggesting signing Leadbitter would be overkill in the summer.

It would of been before Gueds departure.

 

[Alf-engelos Mindminackers]

It would of been before Gueds departure.

I know. Are you saying those posters are right not forseeing Peps departure and suggesting Leadbitter was overkill, but that the club deserve to be constantly criticized for not bringing in a replacement despite their best efforts too?

 

[Robbie Red Hat]

I know. Are you saying those posters are right not forseeing Peps departure and suggesting Leadbitter was overkill, but that the club deserve to be constantly criticized for not bringing in a replacement despite their best efforts too?

You couodnt make it up Alf, don't know why you bother with young mac the lad pal, seems to love you tho

 

[TheDudeII]

Sounds a bit Mark Arthur to me.

This

 

[JordanForest]

Lined up means ready for replacement. Pep wasn't replaced, so he wasn't lined up.

My manager's got Grant Leadbitter signed up to replace someone at work. He's rang him up, and offered him his very best wages. He's not accepted the wages, but he's definitely lined up

We didn't need Leadbitter AND Pep, but we did need Leadbitter OR Pep. So, obviously selling Pep WITHOUT A REPLACEMENT was silly

 

[Project Zeus]

Sorry but totally disagree. Anyone who's ever been involved with football or footballing people knows the false promises that get made and web agents weave. We could have easily been under the impression we were about to sign someone and that a replacement was incoming when we let Pep go. You only have to look at the Hobbs scenario as to why fans shouldn't assume they have the full picture. There's a load more possible scenarios than "bad management".

I didn't say bad management, I said reckless management. Which is precisely what it is if we were not absolutely certain that the replacement that we'd lined up was joining. Not promises from agents and their webs, but physical agreement: accepted bids, and passed medicals - which, on deadline day for when we sold Guedioura, had to have already happened or was happening at the time, if, as you say, we could have had someone close to joining. Agreements and such are useless at 10pm on deadline day when you need to be at a much more advanced stage, getting the player medically tested and signed. We would know if we were close to signing a player that we had agreed terms with, as he'd have been having a medical on deadline day. Nothing gets past the press on that day. There's no other way to do it in that environment so late in the window. Your argument would have more weight if it had happened in the days before the window closed.

Buyers in a transfer market know full well the way that clubs and agents work, and it is their job to make plans for if things go differently, not to sell their basket before they even have a new one to put all their eggs in.

It was clear for the whole transfer window that 'Boro were not selling Leadbitter, just as it was with Sako at Wolves, yet we still didn't identify a plan B defensive mid signing for when we inexplicably decided to let Pep go at the last minute. Refusing his transfer request would have been better than selling him without a replacement already signed. Plenty of players perform well after their clubs refuse moves for them.

I myself thought that Billy wanted both Leadbitter and Guedioura, as he was gathering two strong players for every position, with the plan to then sell Moussi and Gillet. We ended up with neither. Fair enough, the failure to get Leadbitter was out of our hands, but selling Guedioura was completely in our hands, and that is a cock up. No other way about it.

There comes a time when it's better to accept that you're the one who has made the mistake(s), rather than blaming other clubs and agents and blindly putting it down to ''it must be something else beyond our control''. Saying ''we could have easily been close to signing someone'' without any evidence whatsoever to back it up is just naive. The Hobbs situation that you refer to is completely different, as there was multiple clubs involved and negotiations with the player consequently dragged on after we had a bid accepted for Hobbs early on. We did not at any stage have a bid for Leadbitter accepted, and Middlesbrough made it clear that they were not selling.

This isn't some perennial criticism against the club from me, just a recognition of one of their few mistakes. The club has done fantastic work in the transfer market in the last two windows, but this was a failure, and the resulting hole in our squad is testament to that.

I know you will not agree, Alf, as your stubborn refusal to acknowledge any errors whatsoever from the current regime is legendary - quite frankly, I'm not sure why I've bothered to spend five mins typing this! . There's no way I'll see it any other way, however, as I'm looking at the results and facts, not the vague belief that something behind the scenes was forcing us into errors of judgement.

 

[Alf-engelos Mindminackers]

Odd that you'd say I refuse to acknowledge errors of the current regieme when Ive done so only a few posts ago in the Chalobah loan. I view the Geddy situation similar to SODs summer in that circumstance had a bigger influence than people give credit for.

And I agree we pribably should have had other replacements lined up. But IMO it's a minor error of judgement by the club in an otherwise great year and theres only so much we can do, whereas some have ignored all that, ignored the fact we did try and replace Pep (even if you think it could have been done better) and simplifued it to "The manager must burn at the stake for making the concious decision to push Pep out the club and doing nothing to replace him", which is total rubbish IMO.

 

[Project Zeus]

I didn't see the Chalobah post, as I tend to skate over your interactions with McKenzie. Apologies.

I stick by that the whole Guedioura affair was a complete balls-up, but on the balance of things our successes in the transfer market far outweigh our failings, which I certainly have not forgotten. When it comes down to it though I did not think that we'd be promoted this year before we sold Guedioura, and I still don't think we will, so in the grand scheme of things I certainly will not be using it as fuel to burn in an anti-Billy Davies campaign (I've never said or wanted him sacked). But it's undeniable that it's hampered our chances and unsettled our squad. It certainly has been an error that the club has paid for, both in potential points and in effort in bringing in all the loans to replace him. And it's still an ongoing problem, so who knows how it will be resolved. I for one don't think that Vaughan is the answer, as he's far too injury-prone, so I imagine that we'll be in the market for a new DM again in the summer, anyway.

 

[Gingers Across the Midfield]

http://www.francefootball.fr/news/Guedioura-vers-nottingham-forest/441783

Guedioura to Nottingham (Reuters)
Landed this summer at Crystal Palace, Adlène Guedioura should leave the Premier League and return to his former club Nottingham Forest. In lack of playing time, the midfielder should, according to our information, be lent with option to buy in the coming days. He would join his fellow Djamel Abdoun and Rafik Djebbour. Back Championship, Nottingham Forest struggles to regain.

 

[Jimboreds]

Our handling of the defensive midfield position this season may end up costing us.

Its the new left back saga

 

[Alf-engelos Mindminackers]

I didn't see the Chalobah post, as I tend to skate over your interactions with McKenzie. Apologies.

I stick by that the whole Guedioura affair was a complete balls-up, but on the balance of things our successes in the transfer market far outweigh our failings, which I certainly have not forgotten. When it comes down to it though I did not think that we'd be promoted this year before we sold Guedioura, and I still don't think we will, so in the grand scheme of things I certainly will not be using it as fuel to burn in an anti-Billy Davies campaign (I've never said or wanted him sacked). But it's undeniable that it's hampered our chances and unsettled our squad. It certainly has been an error that the club has paid for, both in potential points and in effort in bringing in all the loans to replace him. And it's still an ongoing problem, so who knows how it will be resolved. I for one don't think that Vaughan is the answer, as he's far too injury-prone, so I imagine that we'll be in the market for a new DM again in the summer, anyway.

Don't blame you

Fair play, I'm happy to agree to disagree You're an intelligent chap and I'd be interested to see what you're view is given some time.

 

[Tomas]

The Fall and Rise of Adlène Guedioura

If this happens we need a thread name change

and an entrance song for his return