Robertson
Viv Anderson
Fair play to Bournemouth, they still annoy the hell out of me, but 13/15 points in the last five games against other teams in the bottom seven is good going. Fingers crossed they can finish the job.
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Nuno Herlander Simões Espírito Santo
- Thread starter Robert Learnshaw
- Start date
Gyros Peter
Sauce salad?
So my 'hasn't really had a window' comment referrs to the window after which the new manager came in (squad assessment time? Not so much), where we were charged with an FFP breach, where we pulled in two loan punts via his mate's links and a (good cut price) keeper. I don't think that's a standard window we've been used to, or that it was as good a job as summer, or indeed last year's Jan window.
Of course the window happened, but I think it was severely limited for various factors (above). I'm not denying it happened - of course it did - but I don't see it as normal circumstances for the club. Perhaps it will now become that way following the charge, but it certainly hasn't been up to this point. (Let's not forget last summer we had a manager in post for the last two years working his squad too - there's a big difference no? Or we can compare fees spent?)
You're perfectly entitled to your opinion, as am I to express mine (which disagrees with it for the reasons I stated in the post I made above).
Rather than go around in circles with it (as I'm sure we've both done in the past), I'm happy to leave it there - I stand by my point as I've no doubt you will yours, that's fine, and accept we both want the best for Forest, but probably express that in different ways and have different things that get our goat (or not).
Alf-engelos Mindminackers
The Artiste formally known as "Wanksy"
At a club which recruits above the manager, I'm not sure that Nuno was at any particular disadvantage than anyone else tbh. Maybe we could have moved a few more out as his intentions?
And fair enough, like you say, people express things differently.
Gyros Peter
Sauce salad?
On a different but related note I do wonder about the Reyna and Riberio signings - were they actual Nuno targets or him calling in a favour as he knew we needed to rebalance (and that was our option due to being his agent mate's clients)?
Guess we'll never know, or might if we sign one in summer, though my suspicion is a bit of both, in that Reyna was a yes, taking a look at Riberio was a tag on punt.
IdiotTricky
First Team Squad
There are some interesting and good points made above, re. both SC's and NES' attempts to find a core groups, best XI - or XV - all of which seem to have merit, whether they're related to squad churn or selecting players for specific tactical reasons. And there's been plenty of weeks I've been scratching my head, myself, at some of the selections.
I think, in addition, there's the question around player fitness, training availability, as well as performance.
Personally, give or take a Boly or Dominguez (or even a Sangare, but perhaps next season), last night's XI was probably my own first choice. But I know several posters doubted whether CHO would be fit after the weekend and I haven't a clue how often last night's XI was able to train together ahead of a matchday.
tl;dr: I don't think Nuno's "slow," or stupid, but suspect that managing a struggling team with a squad that's been in a constant state of flux through injuries and AfCon is pretty complex.
Wish he'd get the set piece guy back involved, though.
I think, in addition, there's the question around player fitness, training availability, as well as performance.
Personally, give or take a Boly or Dominguez (or even a Sangare, but perhaps next season), last night's XI was probably my own first choice. But I know several posters doubted whether CHO would be fit after the weekend and I haven't a clue how often last night's XI was able to train together ahead of a matchday.
tl;dr: I don't think Nuno's "slow," or stupid, but suspect that managing a struggling team with a squad that's been in a constant state of flux through injuries and AfCon is pretty complex.
Wish he'd get the set piece guy back involved, though.
IdiotTricky
First Team Squad
Pretty sure Reyna was cover for MGW. We pushed for an option (which we didn't get), so maybe it was with a view to next season, if MGW gets poached/has to go for PSR?
They're both young with potential, which appears to be the way we plan to operate, going forward, so maybe it's just good to have a look and build a relationship? Or, just that they were available. Though I think Reyna had quite a bit of interest from other clubs.
Gyros Peter
Sauce salad?
He did - Reyna is one I think we wanted with an option, but have settled for without. I think we'll go for him in the summer if we stay up. Interested to see what happens with the kid though - there's already an option so we'll see whether that's one we activate...
magicwoand
It tizwas it is
You talk as if these players that were dropped for 'weaker players' hadn't had spells in the season where they have been poor. Danilo has been slated throughout the season at times and had poor games, Dominguez has had the odd stinker. And as for Elanga he's been very productive over the season as a whole, but one of the most profligate playesrs over our recent poor run of form. Elanga with his poor finishing as probably cost us the most points over recent games.
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IdiotTricky
First Team Squad
Generally agree. Danilo hasn't lived up to last season's run-in form; Elanga's early season form replicated in more recent games would definitely have resulted in more goals; and Dominguez is pretty consistent, but capable of the odd 'mare.
I'm hopeful that, with both Danilo and Elanga, they'll only improve - especially if we become a more settled team. With Nico, I think he's done pretty well in his first PL season compared to our other continental signings (thinking Mangala (first season) and - especially - Frueler) and think (hope) they'll all be better next season.
If we stay up, despite having to sell someone for serious money, I think we'll look a more settled team next season.
Rubics
Bin VAR!
We’ll be better off next year just by having a goalkeeper!
Major Oak Morgan
First Team Squad
I’d forgotten about his brief stint at Spurs - some extra motivation to get a win there. #unfinishedbusiness
Elanga's form has been inconsistent of late. To be expected at his age.
He also got dogs abuse from a small but vocal element of his own supporters after Luton away.
Audible as he came over to thank travelling fans at the end . He went off head dropped without hanging around chatting to the kids as you'd expect when you're close up at Kenilworth Road.
Sad to see.
Hope he learns to block it out and feed off the positive energy .- even create the energy as Nuno says.
i saw the Palace selection as a consequence of the Luton game.
Gyros Peter
Sauce salad?
Oh me too as it happens - motivated much?!
Alf-engelos Mindminackers
The Artiste formally known as "Wanksy"
So you think that it hasn't been obvious that the likes of Elanga should have been playing ahead of Origi, or one of Dom & Danilo over Sangare?
I get the criticisms of some of those players have been there, but Nuno seems to just have preferred Origi to Elanga. It feels like he was backed into a corner to make the changes he did last night from previous results. I think he was trying to be too clever starting Origi, and bringing Elanga on as "super sub". I get the idea, but I think he overestimated Origi's ability (or lack of) in front of goal.
Battered Sausage
Matchday Squad
And you know this because ?
Or are you just guessing.
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Alf-engelos Mindminackers
The Artiste formally known as "Wanksy"
magicwoand
It tizwas it is
Sangara has hardly played, he featured in Nuno's second game when we put in our best performance away since promotion. Then went to the ACON, then been injured. It's hardly ridiculous that he would try him again at some point. As I said Elanga has been so profligate of late, it's been annoying, it's not being unreasonable to try someone else there who might actually be able to finish our moves off. Bizarrely Origi actually seems better at keeping the ball than Elanga but has been equally poor at finishing chances. I prefer the threat posed by Elangas pace, but he's got to show more composure.
Alf-engelos Mindminackers
The Artiste formally known as "Wanksy"
I've already covered this earlier in the thread regards Sangare, but if you genuinely think Nuno couldn't have judged that or Origi/Elanga better then I doubt anything I will say will change your mind.
Listen 'ere young man
Jack Burkitt
Put it another way, which player has actually regressed under Nuno?
Can't think of anyone.
Case closed.
On the flip side, Wood has gone from a passable impression of a lamp-post to shades of Messi (a dollop of artist license), has got MGW scoring goals, Williams started looking like a 17m player for once, CHO is beginning to look like his former self again. Omo has gone from a player on the brink of being loaned out in the Jan window to a starter who doesn't look out of place. Tavares has gone from looking like a competition winner to one who you are concerned when he got injured.
Even Origi is gone from a complete non entity to a nearly man.
The passing has come on leaps and bounds (relative to the low bar), we don't treat the football as a hot potato anymore.
Result, we are in every game, having only lost by more than a goal once.
I am pretty sure Sangare will also come good if given further chances to get used to the pace of the league. In our situation at the bottom, we don't have the luxury to play without pressure, in a team without the fear of relegation where every mistake isn't going to be highlighted we will see these players express themselves more and shine. Hoping this is the case next season.
If we can get another couple of wins quickly and settle the nerves, we could well see the embryonic stages of a decent Premier league side.
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Can't think of anyone.
Case closed.
On the flip side, Wood has gone from a passable impression of a lamp-post to shades of Messi (a dollop of artist license), has got MGW scoring goals, Williams started looking like a 17m player for once, CHO is beginning to look like his former self again. Omo has gone from a player on the brink of being loaned out in the Jan window to a starter who doesn't look out of place. Tavares has gone from looking like a competition winner to one who you are concerned when he got injured.
Even Origi is gone from a complete non entity to a nearly man.
The passing has come on leaps and bounds (relative to the low bar), we don't treat the football as a hot potato anymore.
Result, we are in every game, having only lost by more than a goal once.
I am pretty sure Sangare will also come good if given further chances to get used to the pace of the league. In our situation at the bottom, we don't have the luxury to play without pressure, in a team without the fear of relegation where every mistake isn't going to be highlighted we will see these players express themselves more and shine. Hoping this is the case next season.
If we can get another couple of wins quickly and settle the nerves, we could well see the embryonic stages of a decent Premier league side.
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magicwoand
It tizwas it is
What is there to change my mind, I’ve put a valid reason why he has played Origi over Elanga in certain games. If Elanga had been banging in the chances then I would, agree with you, but he hasn’t. Your treating it like it’s a war crime, which is bizarre.
Berkshire Red
Jack Armstrong
Nuno's biggest crime is not being Steve Cooper. FACT.
Monkman
Grenville Morris
It's a bit of a myth that Nuno has completely transformed Wood - he's been pretty good all season when he's actually played, and scored 3 goals in not many appearances under Cooper. He was awful against Everton, but who wasn't. Nuno has been more successful at playing to his strengths but it's hardly night and day.
Ditto Neco really, been much improved all season, albeit again didn't play as often under Cooper.
Ditto Neco really, been much improved all season, albeit again didn't play as often under Cooper.
magicwoand
It tizwas it is
Absolute bollocks.
Monkman
Grenville Morris
Wow, the zealots on both sides of the pointless Cooper vs Nuno battle really don't pull their punches eh. Where's Alf to back me up on this one for a change? 
eyupmeduck
Geoff Thomas
Neco -
This season under SC started 4 games and came on as sub in 4 games out of 17 he managed us for.
Under NES started 10 games came on as sub for 2 out of 14 games NES has managed us for.
Wood -
Started 4 times under SC and came on as sub 8 times. Scored 3 Goals. 2 were against Luton when he started, 1 was coming on as a sub versus Sheffield United.
Under NES, started 9 games, scored 8 goals.
I think these players have had a remarkable upturn in contribution since NES was appointed and it can't be coincidence that he has also started both more as well.
Credit where credit is due imho.
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