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Winter 2022 Transfer Window

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Timothy Pope

I know that Nuno that I know that Nuno that I know
Re: January 2022 Transfer Window

I see a lot of folk saying that we couldn’t afford the wages of said loanees.

We. Don’t. Have. To. Pay. Their. Full. Wage.


Sent from my rectum using poofinger
 
Ashley

Ashley

Steve Chettle
MaxiRobriguez said:
Mount, Oakley-Boothe and Gallgaher all played for clubs without parachute payments. Brewster and Gibbs-White are currently at a Championship club and we have no idea how much they're paying for those loans.

The key is getting them early when they're still raw, not ready for Premier League football and cannot command heavy loans fees the likes of Gilmour, Willock, Gomes and Gallagher would now cost.

Edit: In some cases where there is a fee being mooted it might even be possible to offer the loaning club payment upon promotion, whereby the fee is bigger than what it would have been if paid upfront, on the basis promotion is earned whilst the player is at Forest.
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Oakley-Boothe never went out on loan, he was purchased by parachute payment club Stoke last January. Conor Gallagher last played in this league at parachute payment Swansea, who also had Brewster on loan. Mount went on loan to Derby, who (whilst not in receipt of parachute payments) were spending ludicrous amounts of money up until recently. None of these players would have been cheap, it's not uncommon for Premier League clubs to demand 7 figure loan fees and a big portion of the wages paid for the more sought after loan players.

The problem with signing players early on when they have had little to no experience (which is when they'd likely be within our price range) is that its a gamble; for every player that takes to first team football like a duck to water, there are several that don't (either because they aren't good enough or not ready for senior football yet). Nothing wrong with taking a punt on these kinds players in isolation, but I really wouldn't want to be relying on that sort of signing as a direct replacement for a key player like Johnson.
 
Statto

Statto

Free Kick Specialist
MaxiRobriguez said:
Mount, Oakley-Boothe and Gallgaher all played for clubs without parachute payments. Brewster and Gibbs-White are currently at a Championship club and we have no idea how much they're paying for those loans.

The key is getting them early when they're still raw, not ready for Premier League football and cannot command heavy loans fees the likes of Gilmour, Willock, Gomes and Gallagher would now cost.

Edit: In some cases where there is a fee being mooted it might even be possible to offer the loaning club payment upon promotion, whereby the fee is bigger than what it would have been if paid upfront, on the basis promotion is earned whilst the player is at Forest.
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Brewster isn't on loan, they spent something silly like 15m on him before they went down.
 
M

MaxiRobriguez

Bob McKinlay
Ashley said:
Oakley-Boothe never went out on loan, he was purchased by parachute payment club Stoke last January. Conor Gallagher last played in this league at parachute payment Swansea, who also had Brewster on loan. Mount went on loan to Derby, who (whilst not in receipt of parachute payments) were spending ludicrous amounts of money up until recently. None of these players would have been cheap, it's not uncommon for Premier League clubs to demand 7 figure loan fees and a big portion of the wages paid for the more sought after loan players.

The problem with signing players early on when they have had little to no experience (which is when they'd likely be within our price range) is that its a gamble; for every player that takes to first team football like a duck to water, there are several that don't (either because they aren't good enough or not ready for senior football yet). Nothing wrong with taking a punt on these kinds players in isolation, but I really wouldn't want to be relying on that sort of signing as a direct replacement for a key player like Johnson.
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Swansea had parachute payments yes but they weren't big spenders, one of the reasons Cooper got a bit frustrated there. I doubt they paid huge sums for Brewster, Gallagher, Guehi etc. Gallagher also first went on loan to Charlton.

I'm not saying all those would have been available and all would have been affordable, but that it's an avenue we can explore that we've avoided for far too long because we've placed an emphasis on "experience" regardless of quality. Yes, it can be a gamble giving an untested 17 or 18 year old game time, but to get to that age at some of those academies you've got to have something about you.
 
E

EmmersonForest4

Steve Chettle
This window depends on the aims and ambitions. If we want a genuine crack at promotion instead of consolidation than what we need will be different obviously.
 
BryanRoy22

BryanRoy22

Ian Bowyer
I've always thought Davis has something about him.

Very raw, strong and unpredictable on the ball. Sort of like Marlon Harewood in his early days before things clicked in front of goal finally.

Hopefully that happens for Davis too.
 
Ashley

Ashley

Steve Chettle
Haych said:
We only do loans so I wouldn’t worry.
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One of the few instances where I hope it is only a loan. I was reading a thread on a Villa forum recently and the comments were less than complementary (to put it mildly), not that he'll be fit enough to play many games anyway.
 
Fawazzock

Fawazzock

Jack Burkitt
Re: January 2022 Transfer Window

Cooper emphatic in post match that we need to bring in several new players
 
DizzyBala

DizzyBala

Jack Armstrong
39 appearances in the championship and 3 goals. I'm a little sceptical about this one but can't be any worse than Lyle Taylor.

"But Bala, Lyle is our player."

Yeah, and that is a problem that will hopefully correct itself.
 
G

gamble

Stuart Pearce
Re: January 2022 Transfer Window

Need to hope that the "moneyball" approach works as this signing doesn't inspire me one bit.

Sent from my SM-G998B using Tapatalk
 
congo_red_49

congo_red_49

Ale Ape
The thing about the approach is that it has to be about spotting attributes and traits in players that will work within the coaches preferred tactics and formations - usually before they’ve actually delivered their peak performances. If you’re only looking at players who have already delivered elsewhere, you’re looking at the same players as everyone else and paying a premium for them as a result.
 
Statto

Statto

Free Kick Specialist
congo_red said:
The thing about the approach is that it has to be about spotting attributes and traits in players that will work within the coaches preferred tactics and formations - usually before they’ve actually delivered their peak performances. If you’re only looking at players who have already delivered elsewhere, you’re looking at the same players as everyone else and paying a premium for them as a result.
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Yes, which is what we've always been stupid enough to do when seeming to pursue a policy of signing players who played well against us.

As you say other teams will want the player too if they're playing well against other teams which drives up the price, but there are also a few other unintended consequences - first off, that they played well against us because we're shit, and that the player isn't really very good (see Arron Davies, though that may well have been to get Cohen cheaper). Or they're so well established that their career is either at its peak or just past it which limits your resale options (see Chris Burke).

We need to be the team picking up these players - it's no accident that the likes of Brentca, Watford (and they aren't all on loan from Udi these days), Barnsley, etc keep picking up players who didn't cost them much and who you'd never really heard of and making a team out of them, then selling a star player and not losing out as a team because they have a player to replace them equally. And if it doesn't work they are low cost players unlike Bong and Jenkinson so can be offloaded quietly.

Peterborough had a spell where they seemed to have a load of strikers which they had picked up from other clubs (Britt from Watford, Gayle from Palace etc) where they hadn't really made an impact, scored a lot of goals there, moved on to other clubs and were still successful. Yes signing their top striker would be a good move for you but their owner is astute enough to get a good price for them and also it's better working out how they did it.

As for Keinan Davis, well I've not seen him play but if he is a big hold-up striker then it's the perfect complement for Grabban and also more of a "plan B" striker which we haven't had for a while, when we'd previously had the likes of Adebola, then later Henderson and even Greg Halford, the type who doesn't get many goals themselves but can get a longer ball or a cross and bring others into play, if we're going to play 1 up front then it could solve the #10 position if Grabban can play there then you'd imagine the likes of Brennan (if he brings his scoring boots) and Zinckernagel will be getting a lot more easier chances.

As you say, the approach looks for attributes in players and then looks at players with those which aren't too costly i.e. they are based abroad or in a PL reserve team or something. If this works and Dane/SC have highlighted these players and watched them and want them then we have to trust the process.
 
GreeksBearingGifts

GreeksBearingGifts

Stuart Pearce
Re: January 2022 Transfer Window

Fawazzock said:
Cooper emphatic in post match that we need to bring in several new players
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If he thinks (and can convince the board) that there are still chances for a playoffs position, by all means. But in that case transfers would have to come sooner rather than later.
 
valspoodle

valspoodle

Steve Chettle
Looking forward to this window as we really do have a chance of cracking the top six if the right moves are made.

I know mid-table is the current position we can achieve if nothing is done, but with skill and a dollop of luck, we can do it. Last night, with all the selection problems SC had, we still made a good fist of it, just lacking that killer touch in front of goal.

Fingers crossed. At least, it gives me a reason to get out of bed in the mornings.
 
Otis Redding

Otis Redding

Try A Little Tenderness
valspoodle said:
Looking forward to this window as we really do have a chance of cracking the top six if the right moves are made.

I know mid-table is the current position we can achieve if nothing is done, but with skill and a dollop of luck, we can do it. Last night, with all the selection problems SC had, we still made a good fist of it, just lacking that killer touch in front of goal.

Fingers crossed. At least, it gives me a reason to get out of bed in the mornings.
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Furthermore Richard, even if - as is probably most likely - we don't achieve a play-off place, getting in a couple of our longer-term targets during this window can only be of benefit for next season.
 
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