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Neco Shay Williams

Gyros Peter

Gyros Peter

Sauce salad?
Tobias said:
It's easy to lose perspective with Brennan sometimes - he's younger than Ateef Konate, a member of our U23s who just made his professional debut with Oxford United in the third tier.

Panzo and Back have both looked very good the few times I've seen them this season. Panzo has been out for 4 games with an injury but is expected to play again soon. Back is expected to return in late March, so all being well he'll get a few more games this season and experience a promotion with Carlisle.
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Back is similar to BJ in terms of being from good stock - you'd imagine that having that elite sports experience and guidance close would be a real benefit. Of course, you need talent too, but once you've got so far I think mentality and application are as important.

Panzo is interesting - going by what I've read about him from fans and ex pros around Coventry he has huge potential but remains raw/inconsistent. He's still a baby in terms of his position though at 22, so I'm hopeful he may have a part to play with us... perhaps not next year but the year after. He has less levels to work through (than Back) though so it will be interesting to see what our next choice for him is.

I love seeing young players come through with us, so hope there remains a pathway and that we can get behind the ones doing it now, regardless of whether they cost nothing or 17 million.
 
F

Farhavewetravelled

Youth Team
Gyros Peter said:
Back is similar to BJ in terms of being from good stock - you'd imagine that having that elite sports experience and guidance close would be a real benefit. Of course, you need talent too, but once you've got so far I think mentality and application are as important.

Panzo is interesting - going by what I've read about him from fans and ex pros around Coventry he has huge potential but remains raw/inconsistent. He's still a baby in terms of his position though at 22, so I'm hopeful he may have a part to play with us... perhaps not next year but the year after. He has less levels to work through (than Back) though so it will be interesting to see what our next choice for him is.

I love seeing young players come through with us, so hope there remains a pathway and that we can get behind the ones doing it now, regardless of whether they cost nothing or 17 million.
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If I remember rightly, Back seemed to struggle playing in the first team as a RWB alongside a back three, but seemed to me to be pretty decent as a right back in a back 4.
 
Statto

Statto

Free Kick Specialist
Gyros Peter said:
A year older than Finn Back with 7 champions League appearances*.

(* Admittedly 3 of those equate to less than ten minutes.)
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Interesting now you mention it, yes Fin is only a year or so younger (though I think this is 4/01 vs 9/02 so actually it's 2 "years" apart isn't it if we use an Aug/Sept cut off for a football season and school years).

From what I've seen of both for us, Neco is by far the better athlete, but then Fin was only a teenager when he played for us last season, and you'd expect physically not to be the finished product (we've seen how Brennan's bulked up even since last season). If he uses it correctly, I think Neco also has a better delivery but he does seem to choose the wrong option more than not. But Fin definitely has a lot more between the ears, and seems a lot more tactically aware. Though he was raw, and I think somewhat still getting used to playing RB where he was a CM in age group sides a bit more, I didn't see him be so exposed defensively when he played for us last season, though admittedly this wasn't in the PL.

I think Fin is a bit of a Yates really in that he is bright and seems determined to do the best he can, even if as a player he isn't naturally gifted, he will work hard at what he can. Now I'm not saying Fin and Ryan aren't naturally talented but they don't stand out for it in the main. I don't see Neco is particularly bright despite being technically a lot more gifted. He just doesn't seem to come across that way in interviews and the way he reacts on the pitch.

It's possible the ceiling is higher for Fin because of his work ethic and intelligence which will help him make the most of his not inconsiderable talent.
 
Statto

Statto

Free Kick Specialist
Farhavewetravelled said:
If I remember rightly, Back seemed to struggle playing in the first team as a RWB alongside a back three, but seemed to me to be pretty decent as a right back in a back 4.
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To be fair on Fin, when he played those early games before we got Spence in (and I think we still had Richardson and the other lad whose name escapes me) he was shy of 20 and also new-ish to the position and we were doing shit under Hughton. Later on I think he only played the Boro game when Spence wasn't eligible.

Shows how far we've come in itself really. We're talking about how shit Neco Williams is for us yet not more than 18 months ago Jayden Richardson was playing there for us.
 
Haych

Haych

John Robertson
His potential means nowt if we go down.

The sooner Aurier is back the better, let Neco develop in training while Serge helps keep us up.
 
Gyros Peter

Gyros Peter

Sauce salad?
Statto said:
Interesting now you mention it, yes Fin is only a year or so younger (though I think this is 4/01 vs 9/02 so actually it's 2 "years" apart isn't it if we use an Aug/Sept cut off for a football season and school years).

From what I've seen of both for us, Neco is by far the better athlete, but then Fin was only a teenager when he played for us last season, and you'd expect physically not to be the finished product (we've seen how Brennan's bulked up even since last season). If he uses it correctly, I think Neco also has a better delivery but he does seem to choose the wrong option more than not. But Fin definitely has a lot more between the ears, and seems a lot more tactically aware. Though he was raw, and I think somewhat still getting used to playing RB where he was a CM in age group sides a bit more, I didn't see him be so exposed defensively when he played for us last season, though admittedly this wasn't in the PL.

I think Fin is a bit of a Yates really in that he is bright and seems determined to do the best he can, even if as a player he isn't naturally gifted, he will work hard at what he can. Now I'm not saying Fin and Ryan aren't naturally talented but they don't stand out for it in the main. I don't see Neco is particularly bright despite being technically a lot more gifted. He just doesn't seem to come across that way in interviews and the way he reacts on the pitch.

It's possible the ceiling is higher for Fin because of his work ethic and intelligence which will help him make the most of his not inconsiderable talent.
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Its interesting that Williams had already played CL football at the age Back made his debut for us. He got an assist too - crazy really.

Think you're right about Back positionally- my dad has seen quite a bit of him and rates his passing and delivery as his biggest asset. I expect/hope he will work through the levels like Yates too, though no idea how high he will get - in terms of ceilings it's going to be hard for him to make the levels Williams already has.
 
R

Red Dog in a Forest

Viv Anderson
i
Gyros Peter said:
They've ignored 3 more wins and a draw!

I run the risk of sounding like I'm defending a player who I so far don't really like if I'm honest - he's reactionary (which I don't really like to see in a defender) and so far has not justified the price tag. However...

It's clear he was bought in for his potential, rightly or wrongly ahead of Spence, who so far looks to have similar issues defensively but is better at the side of the game they are both supposed to be good at... and he hasn't played more than twenty minutes at this level, so can't really compare.

It's also clear that Cooper trusts him to some degree, since he keeps using him here and there where other options are available - he rightly isn't first choice though. We have to take the long game here - he isn't justifying the price tag now but the aim has to be to do that over the course of his contract. Let's hope he doesv- Cooper clearly thinks he can be an asset.

I'm also surprised the Athletic have listed those stats, since a minute on a site like soccerbase confirm they're wrong. Poor to use them against a player, especially a young lad. And while not sure how many cup games we've won, surely the most any player can have on their record at the minute is about 10? Think we're won 6 in the league?
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It was a quote on The Athletic, not by the Athletic. Blame Danielle W…and me for quoting.

What was noticeable was that no-one questioned it, not even Paul Taylor.

3 wins and 3 draws in 14 games (if you include where he was taken off at HT) in the league, where he has played more than 45 minutes.

Aurier is 5 wins and 6 draws in 15 games. Admittedly in a more established side..and miles ahead in his development.

Tbh, I think Neco needs a loan next season. I don’t think he’ll improve to the level required by then. If Aurier gets injured again, he’s a liability.

21…plenty of time to be proven wrong, just not seeing it most of the time.
 
It's Baggio

It's Baggio

John Robertson
He's not been great but there does seem an effort to try & pick out every little mistake he makes, similarly with Worrall at the minute.

Someone on Twitter was trying to argue that Neco was at fault for all 4 goals on Saturday, which is nonsense. Fact is if you break each goal down you can just about make all the defensive half of the team culpable one way or another.
 
R

Red Dog in a Forest

Viv Anderson
It's Baggio said:
He's not been great but there does seem an effort to try & pick out every little mistake he makes, similarly with Worrall at the minute.

Someone on Twitter was trying to argue that Neco was at fault for all 4 goals on Saturday, which is nonsense. Fact is if you break each goal down you can just about make all the defensive half of the team culpable one way or another.
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Probably that Danielle W again!

She seems to have it in for Neco...ever since he left in a flat in Liverpool with six kids (none of them his), she's been a nightmare.
 
Gyros Peter

Gyros Peter

Sauce salad?
Red Dog in a Forest said:
i

It was a quote on The Athletic, not by the Athletic. Blame Danielle W…and me for quoting.

What was noticeable was that no-one questioned it, not even Paul Taylor.

3 wins and 3 draws in 14 games (if you include where he was taken off at HT) in the league, where he has played more than 45 minutes.

Aurier is 5 wins and 6 draws in 15 games. Admittedly in a more established side..and miles ahead in his development.

Tbh, I think Neco needs a loan next season. I don’t think he’ll improve to the level required by then. If Aurier gets injured again, he’s a liability.

21…plenty of time to be proven wrong, just not seeing it most of the time.
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21 is key I think - my hope with him is that with a run of games in a settled back 4 (or 5 if we go that way again) he can settle into being a decent option for us and iron out some of the kinks in his game - we've seen how quickly young players can adapt at this level with BJ, who must have at least double the games/learning than his mate.

I think he'll always be a player who looks on the edge - that's not easy on the eye, but as long as it's effective he'll be forgiven. In terms of loans out I'd rather see him progress with us, if as I expect SC decides to keep him with the squad next season (regardless of the level) - he's proven at the champ and I'm not sure he has the 'mentality' to handle being given instructions in a different language.

Im going to go full on cheerleader for Williams - I'd say he is improving: handled Benrahma and Garnacho well in his own way, and somehow we kept a clean sheet against Leeds, where their game plan was get it to that tricky lad on his side... His delivery, while hugely inconsistent, can be very good (see Liverpool match earlier in the year, possibly West Ham too - I forget)...

I think he will firmly establish himself as first choice with a stellar performance against Everton, where he proves key to cutting open Dyche's V (fnar), scores a Colbackesque worldy volley from the cornerflag, assists six and jumps over the Trent end in celebration (injuring himself in the process).

Mark my words - this time next week we will all be worrying that the return of Serge won't be enough to compensate for the loss of the great Neco!

(I think Aurier might start Sunday - but if not go Neco!)
 
Strummer

Strummer

Socialismo O Muerte!
LTLF Minion
Red Dog in a Forest said:
Probably that Danielle W again!

She seems to have it in for Neco...ever since he left in a flat in Liverpool with six kids (none of them his), she's been a nightmare.
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There has got to be a story behind this… sounds like something out of a soap opera?
 
Statto

Statto

Free Kick Specialist
Strummer

Strummer

Socialismo O Muerte!
LTLF Minion
Redemption

Redemption

Agenda Benda
Statto

Statto

Free Kick Specialist
Giant piss flaps
 
PynchonForest

PynchonForest

John Robertson
Speaking of right backs, Richie Laryea man of the match yesterday vs Curacao (who actually have a decent side). Set up our first goal and was fouled repeatedly but didn't react. He was shown a caution by a horrible Costa Rican ref on a corner (before the ball was in play) along with Curacao's number 3, who was subsequently sent off just before half time for an obvious second. The double caution to Laryea and their number 3 was an absolute joke--all the ref had to do was talk to them. Richie is better, right now, than Neco is.
 
Statto

Statto

Free Kick Specialist
PynchonForest said:
No, it's based on an extremely complex algorithm.
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How much of it is "Neco is shite"?

Which, whilst he hasn't been amazing for us, he clearly isn't - Laryea was our reserve for Spence, who wasn't as good as Williams last season.

Having Aurier at the club makes Neco look worse than he is. Aurier is a vastly experienced international who has had a lot spent on him notably by Spurs and PSG and spent most of his time playing in La Liga, Ligue 1 and the PL. Whilst Neco is a kid of 21 who is younger than Spence and has played half a season for Fulham and the odd cameo for Liverpool before we signed him.

He's a weakness when he plays but having Aurier and Lodi around him will show him what a top level FB is like and Cooper will do his best to improve him as well. My doubt is whether he's intelligent enough to move to the level he deserves to be at, though.
 
G

George cooney

Viv Anderson
Needs to start from scratch again. I think their is a player here but he constantly chooses the wrong option. I would class him as the usual player without a brain running around the pitch like a headless chicken..
 
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