Thank You Nigel Doughty

[Mr Jester]

I think the manager should be given a clear budget at the start of each season and if he doesn't like it then he knows what he can do. Whether this has happened at Forest for a very long time is doubtful. I'd much rather the Chairman say to Billy your budget is £2m on transfers and say £1m on wages and he knows where he stands. Rather than a vague statement about backing the manager if he needs it and all the other bull shit statements the clubs hierachy come out with.

Yup. I can see why folk bought into it as I it's quite resonable to think "If we're 3rd in the league and pushing for the 100m prize of promotion and the only real weakness in the squad is a left back then we'll get one" - unfortunately, this was not the case. A budget would thus make total sense.

He does always show for the ball, and he is a better distributor of it, for me. What he lacks, though, is the desire to put his foot in where he might get hirt and break up everything coming through the middle. McKenna did that and it really took the pressure off the defence. We went from having a defence that leaked goals, to having the meanest defence around with McKenna in the middle, to, well leaking goals left right and centre again. Not controlling the midfield is the road to ruin, and Greening, as cultured as he is, isn't the battling ball winning midfielder that McKenna is/was. We need grit and determination in the middle, we need a punk with attitude, someone who isn't afraid to put his weight about. Having that in the iddle means we can have the luxury of players like McGugan. McKenna beats 'em up and robs the ball and gives it to McGugan.

Yup again. People can argue about McKenna all day, and yes last season his legs were shot, but he was the only real man we had in the squad putting the willies up both the opposition and our own players. He just had that bit of steel which we sorely miss, and even if he couldn't move the other 10 on the pitch would be better players for his presence in the side.

I know we did well with Moussi in the side, but that's when things were on the up and going for us, the test is when you hit a snag and most of our players drop their heads, whereas McKenna just dug in and sorted it out.

 

[Rowntree]

He does always show for the ball, and he is a better distributor of it, for me. What he lacks, though, is the desire to put his foot in where he might get hirt and break up everything coming through the middle. McKenna did that and it really took the pressure off the defence. We went from having a defence that leaked goals, to having the meanest defence around with McKenna in the middle, to, well leaking goals left right and centre again. Not controlling the midfield is the road to ruin, and Greening, as cultured as he is, isn't the battling ball winning midfielder that McKenna is/was. We need grit and determination in the middle, we need a punk with attitude, someone who isn't afraid to put his weight about. Having that in the iddle means we can have the luxury of players like McGugan. McKenna beats 'em up and robs the ball and gives it to McGugan. Simples.



People would be outraged if the board sold players without the managers consent, a bit like Kevin Campbell.



What do you mean by budget, though? Just the amount he can spend on players, or players and wages? What about agets fees, and contract sorting?

I think it works better if the manager has a ball park idea of what the owners want by cost, age, ability etc, then do their research and basically 'sell' their findings to the owner.

I agree with your last point but the owner has to have the right people in place who he trusts and who can do their job. If you've got a manager and an advisor that can't agree on anything then you've got the wrong advisor or manager in place, ND moved out both but I think all problems could have been solved with a different middle man. Too late now either way. I also agree on McKenna although I think Greening gets unfair critisism for being his "replacement" as he's a completely different kind of player. We still need a McKenna kind of player because Moussi is pretty shit half of the time but it took about five years to get McKenna in the first place so I'm not holding my breath for somebody else to fill the same role.

 

[Rich]

Yup. I can see why folk bought into it as I it's quite resonable to think "If we're 3rd in the league and pushing for the 100m prize of promotion and the only real weakness in the squad is a left back then we'll get one" - unfortunately, this was not the case. A budget would thus make total sense.

I suppose it depends on your thoughts. All the while we had Joel Lynch and Julian Bennett. If we went out and bought a left back for left backs sake it would have been pointless.

Getting the right one was crucial, and I honestly believe we tried everything to get Nicky Shorey. With him we would be a good Premiership side now, in my opinion.

Yup again. People can argue about McKenna all day, and yes last season his legs were shot, but he was the only real man we had in the squad putting the willies up both the opposition and our own players. He just had that bit of steel which we sorely miss, and even if he couldn't move the other 10 on the pitch would be better players for his presence in the side.

I agree with that in it's entirety. Letting him go was the right decision, as I don't think he would be as effective now, but what we need was him aged 3 years younger again. He was a proper leader, and despite being the smallest on the field he clearly kept up whatever it was Billy was saying in the dressing room out on the pitch. Having a captain and a manager singing from the same hymn sheet was probably more important than we realise.

 

[Rich]

I agree with your last point but the owner has to have the right people in place who he trusts and who can do their job. If you've got a manager and an advisor that can't agree on anything then you've got the wrong advisor or manager in place, ND moved out both but I think all problems could have been solved with a different middle man. Too late now either way. I also agree on McKenna although I think Greening gets unfair critisism for being his "replacement" as he's a completely different kind of player. We still need a McKenna kind of player because Moussi is pretty shit half of the time but it took about five years to get McKenna in the first place so I'm not holding my breath for somebody else to fill the same role.

Yeah, good points. People look to Greening as a direct McKenna replacement, which he isn't. He's a much more cultured footballer at a time when we need a Sunday league hacker. Saturday was a good example. We were the better side and Palace were bullies. Our 'hard man' limped off the pitch early on, and the rest of the team got kicked all over. No one from Forest gave them a kicking back, no one asserted our dominance, so when a late challenge went in and itall kicked off our young players lost their heads. Sure enough, 2 minutes later Palace score.

I honestly believe that wouldn't have happened with McKenna. If it kicked off we just got revved up, we didn't lose focus. If a player was getting bullied on the pitch McKenna put the late boot in and took a yellow. We just don't have that mentality anymore and it's costing us.

 

[Itsy-bitsy Bonatini Yellow Polkadot Bikini]

Yeah, good points. People look to Greening as a direct McKenna replacement, which he isn't. He's a much more cultured footballer at a time when we need a Sunday league hacker. Saturday was a good example. We were the better side and Palace were bullies. Our 'hard man' limped off the pitch early on, and the rest of the team got kicked all over. No one from Forest gave them a kicking back, no one asserted our dominance, so when a late challenge went in and itall kicked off our young players lost their heads. Sure enough, 2 minutes later Palace score.

I honestly believe that wouldn't have happened with McKenna. If it kicked off we just got revved up, we didn't lose focus. If a player was getting bullied on the pitch McKenna put the late boot in and took a yellow. We just don't have that mentality anymore and it's costing us.

He was very clearly Billy's on pitch lieutenant, which is also the function I imagine McClaren had envisaged for Boateng. Every manager has one.

Cotterill desperately needs his own men, on and off the pitch. Until he gets that, how can he be expected to do anything other than struggle?

 

[Mr Jester]

Having a captain and a manager singing from the same hymn sheet was probably more important than we realise.

I think that this is absolutely vital to success - Clough + McGovern, Clough + Pearce, Ferguson + Keane, Wenger + Viera, etc. etc.

He was very clearly Billy's on pitch lieutenant, which is also the function I imagine McClaren had envisaged for Boateng. Every manager has one.

Cotterill desperately needs his own men, on and off the pitch. Until he gets that, how can he be expected to do anything other than struggle?

Yup, if any of McGugan, Miller or Derbyshire can fund the finances for a general in the team then I'd gladly offload them. Folk don't realise just how much Cotterill's hands are tied at the moment.

 

[Rich]

Yup, if any of McGugan, Miller or Derbyshire can fund the finances for a general in the team then I'd gladly offload them. Folk don't realise just how much Cotterill's hands are tied at the moment.

I think everyone realises how much his hands are tied, people just have different opinions on why they're tied.

There isn't a player in the squad I wouldn't offload for a younger McKenna right now.

 

[Hoax]

Why do we need to bring someone in though. Surely there must be someone in the sodding team that can grab his pitiful, well paid, dream job life by the balls and become a leader? Camps got a gob, chambers has a gob the problem is I guess neither of them have the experience. This IMO is the sole reason Chambers should never have been made captain. Young, naive and very little experience at this level

 

[Rich]

Camp isn't in the position to defend the players on the field, though. McKenna was in a position where he, to coin a phrase, had their backs. Whatever went on, he was in there defending the players. They need to protection that comes from someone like him to be able to play the kind of football they want.

Why do you think Man Utd always had a Keane or a Scholes? Nasty yellow card merchants protect the players who win the games. We simply don't have that anymore, which is why we look scared of playing teams like Crystal Palace (who, in their yellow kit, were a bit too much like a 1970s Don Revie side).

 

[matt1982]

He was very clearly Billy's on pitch lieutenant, which is also the function I imagine McClaren had envisaged for Boateng. Every manager has one.

Cotterill desperately needs his own men, on and off the pitch. Until he gets that, how can he be expected to do anything other than struggle?

I don't think so. i think it was more of a desperate, who can we get in sort of move, that seemed to fit the 'experienced' label McClaren claimed we needed.

Unfortunately McClaren forgot he was a. too old b. now well past his best c. likely to be injured most of the time and d. we were already pretty well off for central midfield players and didn't need many more.

Instead he went and got 3 more :facepalm:

 

[Hoax]

I am one of said nasty yellow card merchant players! Well in my hayday anyway. Still if not Camp there must be someone. We cant have a squad of cowards can we?

 

[TheDude]

They're all puffs and showing no fight

 

[Itsy-bitsy Bonatini Yellow Polkadot Bikini]

I don't think so. i think it was more of a desperate, who can we get in sort of move, that seemed to fit the 'experienced' label McClaren claimed we needed.

Unfortunately McClaren forgot he was a. too old b. now well past his best c. likely to be injured most of the time and d. we were already pretty well off for central midfield players and didn't need many more.

Instead he went and got 3 more :facepalm:

Really? Not convinced. I'm pretty sure he regarded Boateng as a like for like upgrade on McKenna. For all of our central midfielders, there's a certain type of CM that we're missing - if you take Boateng out of the equation. He's gonna be absolutely vital to us when he's fit again.

I nearly sicked in my mouth as I was typing that.

 

[Rowntree]

Really? Not convinced. I'm pretty sure he regarded Boateng as a like for like upgrade on McKenna. For all of our central midfielders, there's a certain type of CM that we're missing - if you take Boateng out of the equation. He's gonna be absolutely vital to us when he's fit again.

I nearly sicked in my mouth as I was typing that.

Honestly, I think if we could just get Chambers out of defence for a while - I know we have no replacements - we'd be alright. Having a defender in the side who'll guarantee the opposition a goal a game as long as they try to score must be disconcerting for the rest of the team and must put all of them under a lot of pressure and over the course of the season must have sapped a lot of confidence. He's the captain too when to me he's the absolute last person who should be considering his form this season.

 

[Mr Jester]

Camp isn't in the position to defend the players on the field, though. McKenna was in a position where he, to coin a phrase, had their backs. Whatever went on, he was in there defending the players. They need to protection that comes from someone like him to be able to play the kind of football they want.

Why do you think Man Utd always had a Keane or a Scholes? Nasty yellow card merchants protect the players who win the games. We simply don't have that anymore, which is why we look scared of playing teams like Crystal Palace (who, in their yellow kit, were a bit too much like a 1970s Don Revie side).

Zactly. By far and away the biggest single positive step we could take is to re-introduce that leadership and steel into the team............

Really? Not convinced. I'm pretty sure he regarded Boateng as a like for like upgrade on McKenna. For all of our central midfielders, there's a certain type of CM that we're missing - if you take Boateng out of the equation. He's gonna be absolutely vital to us when he's fit again.

I nearly sicked in my mouth as I was typing that.

................however I aint sure that Boat's the answer. I really don't look forward to seeing Greening and Boat in the middles of the park together again. Hopefully tho, if this does happen Cotterill might find a way to make it work.

Honestly, I think if we could just get Chambers out of defence for a while - I know we have no replacements - we'd be alright. Having a defender in the side who'll guarantee the opposition a goal a game as long as they try to score must be disconcerting for the rest of the team and must put all of them under a lot of pressure and over the course of the season must have sapped a lot of confidence. He's the captain too when to me he's the absolute last person who should be considering his form this season.

Sounds strange but if we had all the centre halves fit I'd consider giving Chambers a go in the DM role. He might be dross in the role, but with instructions of "kick people and get in the box for headers" then who knows?

 

[TheDude]

Can remember when Billy put Chambers in at DM off the bench away at Palace and everyone went mad after the game.

 

[Anatoli]

I like those clever people who can eruditely reply with three quotes.

I'd get to the end of the first one then go off looking for pictures of squirrels on motorbikes.

 

[Mr Jester]

I like those clever people who can eruditely reply with three quotes.

I'd get to the end of the first one then go off looking for pictures of squirrels on motorbikes.

I think getting "eruditely" into a sentence is clevererer :tophat:

 

[RutlandRed]

Doughty is a f***ing lanky peace of piss who has ruined this football club and killed it and has not got the balls to put it right !!!

 

[TheDude]

Don't hold back, tell us what you really think!

 

[RutlandRed]

haha i will dude !! i despise the man for what he has done to us.

"Will back manager when we in a position of strength", we were in a position of strength in the 2 january windows billy was here, what happend? oh yeah f*** all, others around us invested and they went up and we were left with injuries etc leaving us thread bare and James Perch at left f***ing back killing us v blackpool !!!

we wouldnt have gone under without doughty, no football club has gone into extinction...we wouldn't have either !!!

 

[Forest ash]

you shouldnt be insulting him on a personnal level thats not right at all.

The one thing i will say though is that he shouldnt of just dissapeared in the way he has imo

And it would be great if he did right his wrong

 

[thehockleyhustler]

you shouldnt be insulting him on a personnal level thats not right at all.

The one thing i will say though is that he shouldnt of just dissapeared in the way he has imo

And it would be great if he did right his wrong

Pretty much my feelings.

I know he has agreed to honour contracts signed under his regime etc but he really has left us up shit creek without a. Paddle.

In my opinion, he should have stuck around whilst actively looking for a new buyer or outside investment from elsewhere.

 

[TheDude]

I wonder how actively he is seeking a new buyer?

Not a lot would be my guess. More taking a break and seeing how it goes.

 

[James_NFFC]

For me, Nigel Doughty is a decent fellow and clearly an intelligent business man, and on the whole, I'm pleased he was our Chairman. His heart was in the right place, even if his head wasn't at times.

He did make some very poor decisions during his tenure at the club, and while it was admirable of him to stand down, I would have preferred him to admit his wrong doings, offer an olive branch to Billy Davies and given us that one final financial boost (FFP or no FFP - I'm sure we'd have achieved promotion and then it would have'll been irrelevant).

Personally, I believe Billy Davies was the right man for this club. His Us vs the World mentality brought the best out of our players and while I do think he was at times tedious, his positive points far outweighed his negatives.

We are a poorer club without him.