Official Europa League Matchday Thread #6. Utrecht v Nottingham Forest. 11/12/2025. 17:45

[JonnoSnr]

Not really, my reasoning is actually much more simple in that Marinakis was already sounding out a Nuno replacement before all the shit kicked off in the close season because he thought there was limits to pragmatic type football and wanted a more progressive coach to take us onto the next level. Did the same with Cooper too.

Marinakis has shown over the years that he reverts back to his desires even if they fail once. Same thing re: transfer policy, we go through cycles of carefully targeted, constrained spending and then spending shit loads and hope they stick. Marinakis likes to twist, he's never been content with slow and steady and so I just don't think Marinakis will ever see a Dyche type appointment as a long term manager here. As long as we're firefighting relegation he's OK with it as we need to be pragmatic to secure future revenues, but as soon as the season is done and we're not 18th, 19th or 20th then that pragmatism is no longer needed and there's the space to go again in a different direction.

Ultimately don't think results will really play into it at all. Only way Dyche goes beyond summer is if we win the EL and have a strong end to season in the PL to the point it's impossible to sack him, and I think that's an unfair ask because it's an almost impossible ask.

Yeah I think, despite the length of contract, Dyche is here for this season and this season only unless he produces something magical.

It's win/win for him really, he becomes relevant again at this level, manages the best group of players he's ever had and hopefully keeps us up to maintain his reputation and gets a lovely pay off in the process. No wonder Woan and Stone were doing cartwheels in the car park.

We've been decent under him so far. He's just come in and fixed the basics really which was all we needed to be a competitive side at this level again. I'm not convinced he has it in him tactically to go onto a different level and consistently win those nip and tuck games against similar levelled opposition but we'll see on that I suppose. What concerned me is that in those games against teams supposedly in our bracket - Brighton, Everton and Bournemouth we were thoroughly outclassed in all of them.

 

[Captain Sinister]

Have to be careful reading into this too much.

4 of those 6 came against Wolves, Leeds, Malmo and Utretch. A 5th was against Liverpool who are coughing up points to everyone at the moment. Only the Porto win really stands out as statement win for me.

Our results follow a pattern of beating weaker teams but struggling to get any sort traction in teams who are mid table PL or better. We were comprehensively beaten by Bournemouth, Everton and Brighton for example.

Not saying we're shit or anything but trying to extrapolate headline results is hiding the underlying reality. We'll likely be ok this season now but there's next to zero chance of maintaining such a win rate when the harder fixtures come around.

Come on Maxi, get with the vibe.
There are no easy wins in the Prem, everyone knows that, and any team going into a match believing it will be an easy win is likely to take a tumble.
Pride always goeth before a fall.

 

[MaxiRobriguez]

There are no easy wins in the Prem

Wolves fans: *shifty eyes*

 

[Strummer]

We are a famous old club.

We are also the famous oldest club.

 

[Statto]

Yeah I think, despite the length of contract, Dyche is here for this season and this season only unless he produces something magical.

It's win/win for him really, he becomes relevant again at this level, manages the best group of players he's ever had and hopefully keeps us up to maintain his reputation and gets a lovely pay off in the process. No wonder Woan and Stone were doing cartwheels in the car park.

We've been decent under him so far. He's just come in and fixed the basics really which was all we needed to be a competitive side at this level again. I'm not convinced he has it in him tactically to go onto a different level and consistently win those nip and tuck games against similar levelled opposition but we'll see on that I suppose. What concerned me is that in those games against teams supposedly in our bracket - Brighton, Everton and Bournemouth we were thoroughly outclassed in all of them.

The issue was that we decided to keep Nuno in post, buy a few players like McAtee who were more suited to just having the ball, but without doing that across the system, which would cost too much anyway, and having the manager doing preseason who wasn't suited to using these players.

Ange would be suited to playing a more possession based/more attacking style, but he only had a partial squad to do this, and he didn't have the benefit of a full preseason with them, they barely had time between matches with players off on international duty and at other times playing 2x a week. He was shit too, but in his defence, it was never going to work.

Dyche is more similar to Nuno but at Burnley and Everton he never had a squad capable of doing more than keeping heads above water. You're right he's fixed the basics and we probably look better at set plays than under Nuno. And we still play more on the front foot than under Nuno. It's also clear he's inherited a few injury issues and general lack of fitness in the squad - Aina has never played under him, and we haven't had a fully fit Wood (who he knows from Burnley) really since he joined. It was good to see Murillo, Luiz and Zinchenko back for numbers (though I still think Zinchenko is shit) and having Aina back will be a big boost for us, and that might help get some extra points in matches.

Moving on tactically can be a bit of a chicken and egg situation, because to a large extent, we need both the manager and the players to play that way, and at the moment largely speaking we don't really have either. But, there's a fair argument for giving Dyche some of these players so they can settle in to the club and see how he can build the playing style and then probably move on to a new manager if it isn't there after next season. The fall back would then be that we would still have a manager who has Plan B in their locker and would keep the basics right, which Ange didn't do.

 

[Captain Sinister]

EM is clearly an aggressive "only winning matters" businessman,.
If Dyche keeps on winning, gets us to semi-respectable safety in the Prem, and to the final of the Europa, and/or the FA Cup I can't see EM being so dogmatic as to sack Dyche and take a gamble on Silva, or someone else.
The continuation of Dyche, Woan and Stone is in their own hands.

 

[Statto]

EM is clearly an aggressive "only winning matters" businessman,.
If Dyche keeps on winning, gets us to semi-respectable safety in the Prem, and to the final of the Europa, and/or the FA Cup I can't see EM being so dogmatic as to sack Dyche and take a gamble on Silva, or someone else.
The continuation of Dyche, Woan and Stone is in their own hands.

I'm sure EM would rather finish 7th under Dyche playing a more pragmatic style than 14th under someone like Ange with their kamikaze attacking as well.

I'm not sure what managers we could go for who could achieve that style quickly anyway. I'm specifically thinking of Hughton being replaced by Potter at Brighton, but I don't think Potter would be the answer anyway. City under Pellegrini managed to move from a relatively average side to one which won titles, and probably made it easier for Pep to improve them, but this also had the benefit of money and no PSR.

Last season skewed expectations because we had a good run where everything dropped for us. With the extra EL matches (considering we are now likely to get at least a play off) we won't get near last season anyway and were not likely to, so we need to be careful how we assess what would look like a good result.

 

[Louth Red]

Given the circumstances it was a well-deserved victory aided by good use of substitutes by SD.

It’s effectively in our own hands given the next two opponents.

Quite why we are discussing the manager for 2026/27 in this thread is beyond me.

Well done to our sellout travelling support.

 

[MaxiRobriguez]

I'm sure EM would rather finish 7th under Dyche playing a more pragmatic style than 14th under someone like Ange with their kamikaze attacking as well.

Evidence would suggest not, given we finished 7th under Nuno with Ange finishing 17th at Spurs and yet Marinakis still made moves to sound out the latter taking over the former.

 

[redforest]

Given the circumstances it was a well-deserved victory aided by good use of substitutes by SD.

It’s effectively in our own hands given the next two opponents.

Quite why we are discussing the manager for 2026/27 in this thread is beyond me.

Well done to our sellout travelling support.

Definitely well done to the support in the ground but does anyone know what it was like in the fan zone in town? I was tempted but couldn’t really justify the expense when the pub here was easily available

 

[Apollo11]

Evidence would suggest not, given we finished 7th under Nuno with Ange finishing 17th at Spurs and yet Marinakis still made moves to sound out the latter taking over the former.

Where's the evidence? There is a lot of hearsay from what I've seen but no evidence. There is evidence of Marinakis offering Nuno a new contract though which sort of rubbishes any claims he wanted him out.

 

[Erik]

Have to be careful reading into this too much.

4 of those 6 came against Wolves, Leeds, Malmo and Utretch. A 5th was against Liverpool who are coughing up points to everyone at the moment. Only the Porto win really stands out as statement win for me.

Totally get your reasoning and don't necessarily disagree with what you are saying but if you look at what went before those wins would have turned into -
Wolves (L), Leeds (L), Malmo (D), Utretch (L), Liverpool (L) so Dyche is an infinite upgrade.

 

[Red Echo]

Yeah I think, despite the length of contract, Dyche is here for this season and this season only unless he produces something magical.

It's win/win for him really, he becomes relevant again at this level, manages the best group of players he's ever had and hopefully keeps us up to maintain his reputation and gets a lovely pay off in the process. No wonder Woan and Stone were doing cartwheels in the car park.

We've been decent under him so far. He's just come in and fixed the basics really which was all we needed to be a competitive side at this level again. I'm not convinced he has it in him tactically to go onto a different level and consistently win those nip and tuck games against similar levelled opposition but we'll see on that I suppose. What concerned me is that in those games against teams supposedly in our bracket - Brighton, Everton and Bournemouth we were thoroughly outclassed in all of them.

I do think that some of the discussion about Dyche's ceiling with this team should be reserved until Aina is back. Even Nuno struggled whenever he was out.

There might be some fireworks down that side with the Aina/Hutch combination.

I think he's a manager who could consistently give us top 10 finishes in the Prem with a settled side. Moyes-lite. I'm not sure if that will be enough for big boss though, as others have said.

 

[GregorRobertson]

I do think that some of the discussion about Dyche's ceiling with this team should be reserved until Aina is back. Even Nuno struggled whenever he was out.

There might be some fireworks down that side with the Aina/Hutch combination.

I think he's a manager who could consistently give us top 10 finishes in the Prem with a settled side. Moyes-lite. I'm not sure if that will be enough for big boss though, as others have said.

Not to mention Chris Wood.

 

[MaxiRobriguez]

Where's the evidence? There is a lot of hearsay from what I've seen but no evidence. There is evidence of Marinakis offering Nuno a new contract though which sort of rubbishes any claims he wanted him out.

There was plenty of talk of Postecoglou replacing Nuno weeks before he was actually sacked.

Here's the first article I found after a simple Google:

Ange Postecoglou linked to Nottingham Forest job

Greek Australian coach Ange Postecoglou has once again been thrust into the spotlight after being linked with the Nottingham Forest job.

greekherald.com.au

And there was plenty of talk of Nuno leaving before the Chelsea game, with Roma reportedly interested in poaching him after his & Marinakis relationship had apparently broken down.

It could well be hearsay, but there was an awful lot of it, and not in any sense normal if your head coach and owner are happy still.

 

[Statto]

Evidence would suggest not, given we finished 7th under Nuno with Ange finishing 17th at Spurs and yet Marinakis still made moves to sound out the latter taking over the former.

If Nuno was making life difficult for Edu, whom EM had appointed not just for Forest but for his other clubs too, then ultimately if that couldn't be reconciled it was only going one way.

Look at that situation and then also look at the fact that Nuno was dismissed for non-footballing reasons, there would potentially have been all sorts of actions behind the scenes maybe disciplinary processes if it was considered misconduct or insubordination.

The fact that EM wanted a manager to play in that style, one was available, who also happened to be Greek... I don't think league positions came into it. It seemed like a perfect storm only that we didn't have the time or the players for it to work.

Had Nuno been sacked for coming 7th and Ange had come in, you could still see it as evidence for progression on the field.

 

[MaxiRobriguez]

I'm not trying to argue any other point that Dyche isn't guaranteed to keep his job even if we finish 7th by the way.

 

[Statto]

I'm not trying to argue any other point that Dyche isn't guaranteed to keep his job even if we finish 7th by the way.

Depends on info we won't ever get.

He has been given a contract which means that the club and he intend to be our manager for that time period, and for it to be paid out if the club decides otherwise before that time passes.

It will probably be subject to performance conditions being met and a whole host of other things.

One of those will probably be staying up, maybe achieving a play off place in the EL, maybe even a FA cup run.

We look back and think MON was clearly an interim because they wanted Lamouchi and he wouldn't come at the time. But the club has never said this nor would they.

If the intention is that Dyche keeps us up and then they "look again" at the situation, it's probably something they're all aware of.

 

[Apollo11]

There was plenty of talk of Postecoglou replacing Nuno weeks before he was actually sacked.

Here's the first article I found after a simple Google:

Ange Postecoglou linked to Nottingham Forest job

Greek Australian coach Ange Postecoglou has once again been thrust into the spotlight after being linked with the Nottingham Forest job.

greekherald.com.au

And there was plenty of talk of Nuno leaving before the Chelsea game, with Roma reportedly interested in poaching him after his & Marinakis relationship had apparently broken down.

It could well be hearsay, but there was an awful lot of it, and not in any sense normal if your head coach and owner are happy still.

I noted your response about Dyche so wont get sidetracked and go down the same rabbit hole we all have in the past about this, just one last thing.

Postecoglou was looked at before Nuno was sacked but most importantly after hehad twice rocked the boat, I dont think its unreasonable and neither does it show that Marinakis wanted him replaced despite league position.

 

[Baronvon]

I noted your response about Dyche so wont get sidetracked and go down the same rabbit hole we all have in the past about this, just one last thing.

Postecoglou was looked at before Nuno was sacked but most importantly after hehad twice rocked the boat, I dont think its unreasonable and neither does it show that Marinakis wanted him replaced despite league position.

Indeed.

Happy to be corrected, but i don't recall any rumours of Nuno being replaced until he decided to self immolate.

He'd only just signed a new contract after all.

 

[GregorRobertson]

Indeed.

Happy to be corrected, but i don't recall any rumours of Nuno being replaced until he decided to self immolate.

He'd only just signed a new contract after all.

There were definitely rumours. But then on the other hand there were also rumours Nuno was considering his options himself, just as there were the summer before. It would have been remiss for EM not to sound out options under those circumstances. Though you could certainly argue he should have sounded out some better options than Ange Postecoglu.

 

[Caveman Ninja]

Currently in Amsterdam Airport waiting for a flight to Athens and have seen several real live Forest fans. This, for me, is an exciting occurrence. Apologies to anyone who got You Redsed a little too enthusiastically by a bald bloke in an Iron Maiden football shirt.

 

[Strummer]

Currently in Amsterdam Airport waiting for a flight to Athens and have seen several real live Forest fans. This, for me, is an exciting occurrence. Apologies to anyone who got You Redsed a little too enthusiastically by a bald bloke in an Iron Maiden football shirt.

This is the way!

 

[Trents]

EM is clearly an aggressive "only winning matters" businessman,.
If Dyche keeps on winning, gets us to semi-respectable safety in the Prem, and to the final of the Europa, and/or the FA Cup I can't see EM being so dogmatic as to sack Dyche and take a gamble on Silva, or someone else.
The continuation of Dyche, Woan and Stone is in their own hands.

I dunno. Silva is obviously stringing out his new contract renewals at Fulham. I recon if EM can get him he'll be here next summer regardless of what Dyche achieves this season.

 

[Mr H]

Great clip - thanks for posting.